Law Professor: "Shameful to support men and women who have gone overseas to kill other human beings."

 
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Law Professor: "Shameful to support men and women who have gone overseas to kill other human beings."

Whenever people ask me why I initially quit law school to volunteer to go to Afghanistan as an Infantryman, I only half-jokingly tell them I preferred sleeping on the ground and looking for the Taliban to being around the pretentious jackasses one finds at law schools from time to time.  When I got back, the first article I read in the Law School newsletter was about how the first year of law school is the hardest year anyone could ever have,  Well sure, except almost every year that our men and women spend in the military.  In law school you generally get fed fairly regularly, don't get shot at, and don't have to pull radio guard at 2 a,m,  This isn't exactly a newsflash, but there is nothing inherently difficult about attending classes and reading books.  I'm not saying that to degrade higher education, but comparing it to dodging 7.62 rounds is a bit....hyperbolic.

And then along comes someone who proves my point with far more alacrity than I could muster on my own.  Everyone, meet Professor Michael Avery:

The email may have been brief, but with it Suffolk Law Professor Michael Avery seems to have poured salt into the wounds of quite a few Americans, including some students at his own school.

In the five-paragraph e-mail to colleagues in response to a school-wide appeal for care packages for deployed soldiers, Avery calls the notion of sending packages “shameful”.

"I think it is shameful that it is perceived as legitimate to solicit in an academic institution for support for men and women who have gone overseas to kill other human beings" wrote Avery.

 

Local professor: Collecting care packages for troops is 'shameful': MyFoxBOSTON.com

For some more on this guy, you can go to the "Above the Law" blog where the writer just skewers this clown.

Somewhat ironically, the very first person to wish me a Happy Veterans Day was a buddy of mine who just happens to be a Suffolk Law Graduate.  The school is going with the old stand-by of "he has a right to say what he wants."

In the long history of Suffolk University, we have embraced discourse within the framework of the Constitution and Bill of Rights. We encourage free discussion; yet remain uncompromising in confronting acts of discrimination. As Suffolk's history shows, all of this can be done while supporting our mission to provide access to excellence in education to those who deserve it, not the least of whom are active duty military personnel and returning veterans, who by their brave acts have honored each of us and our nation.

Indubitably true. He also has the right to pee on an electric fence or inhale Clorox, but it doesn't make it either sensible or reflect well on the schook.

The whole thing did segue nicely with an article in the Washington Post this morning though:

The troops are lavished with praise for their sacrifices. But the praise comes with a price, service members say. The public increasingly acts as if it feels sorry for those in uniform.

“We aren’t victims at all,” said Brig. Gen. Sean B. MacFarland, who commanded troops in Iraq and will soon leave for Afghanistan. “But it seems that the only way that some can be supportive is to cast us in the role of hapless souls.”

The topic is a sensitive one for military leaders, who do not want to appear ungrateful or at odds with the public they serve. They also realize that the anger that returning troops faced in the latter years of the Vietnam War was far worse.

As a result, most of the conversations about pity take place quietly and privately among combat veterans. After his two sons returned from combat tours with the Marines, retired Col. Mark Cancian warned them that people outside the military would view their service from two perspectives.

All things being equal, if I had to chose between being back in law school, being pitied for my service in the military, or serving as an infantryman again, the choice would be easy, and I would be singing this diddy tomorrow as the sun set:

Up in the morning out of the rack
Greeted at dawn with an early attack

First Sergeant Rushes me off to chow
But I don’t eat it any how

Oh hail Oh Hail oh Infantry
Queen of Battle follow me

An airborne ranger’s life for me
Cause nothing in this world is free

Pick up your rifle and follow me.

In a big bird up in the sky,
all will jump and some will die

Off to battle we will go,
to live or die, hell I don’t know

Oh hail oh hail oh infantry
Queen of battle follow me

I look to the sky I have no fear,
My Ranger God is always near.

Oh hail Oh hail oh infantry
Queen of battle follow me

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Does this professor that is obvously smarter than all of us propose that we let the enemy just walk into our county and kill us. The greatest single loss of life was 9-11 and if that is what he thinks, then he should get first in line to die waiting for soldiers that he obviously wants to get rid of.

God bless our troops. Signed Troup of 1958 and dam proud of it.

I liked the Email idea and forgave him for his stupidity.

I expect nothing less from some academic who spent 1968-69 studying at the U. of Moscow, U.S.S.R. Seems a lot of us were "studying" communism from a far different perspective at the same time.

Who gives a shit what this guy thinks? Ignore him. It's one persons opinion. Contrary to mine, and I couldn't care less what he thinks. He has the right to think and say what he wants. Unfortunately he has a better forum then most of us to express his views. I (Vietnam Vet 69") still don't care about his opinion and wonder why so man y others do.

As a Vietnam vet, I didn't have to worry much about anyone on the campuses doing anything as "shameful" as asking for anything to be sent to any of us who were over there killing other humans (which, BTW, as an infantryman, I did with as much vigor as possible lest I be the one killed). They all hated us. Despite that and the professor's offending opinion, I am proud to have been able to devote much of my life to defending his right to say whatever he pleases, however stupid that may be. That, my fellow vets and friends, is what we do.

This so-called law proffesor is what is wrong with our educational system and society.These people with their i'm ok your ok philosphy are poisoning our educational system with their demands of conformity, or you do not pass. He has a right to his view.I wonder if the board of this college revued his views.If they did.Why was he hired?

The majority of people living in the east recognize Suffolk Law School as a third rate law school with fourth rate law professors. Typical raving liberal asshole exercising his first amendment rights. It's not what Avery says that bothers me, it is his flawed character that promulgates his thoughts.

I'll start by saying that this fellow must be some kind of egotist. I would hope that he is just looking for attention. By getting irate and stomping around you will do nothing but insure that he has an erection and glorifies his own self worth.

I suspect that Mr. Avery is a collaborator at the very least and probably a terrorist. Why would he ever place his sentences to public view and comment. His words attack our Military morale and also the morale of our citizens at home.

I believe that he is capable of becoming a true bane to our Country as a whole. He will, if my money is bet right be first in line to surrender and be part of the Enemy the rest of us fight. He is a little man of no self worth who seems to be enjoying the freedom of speech our Constitution provides him. Well, maybe he is just a leech feeding off the rights and values of a country that he would not defend and populated by citizens he would help herd to the death chambers of an oppressor. Whatever he may be I'm sure he is to be pitied.

He has the right to express his feelings on this subject, he has no right to teach it. Want to bet that he gives his opinion as fact in classes he teaches? Fortunately, I also have the right to voice my opinion, which I developed in the army in 65 and 66, and the police force for the 40 years after that. I believe that the professor is out of touch with reality, not particularly brght, a disgrace to his school, a coward too denigrate men and women who are in harms way protecting his sorry butt and a weasle would be ashamed to have him in its family tree. Just my opinion. Chuck

"He has the right to express his feelings on this subject, he has no right to teach it. Want to bet that he gives his opinion as fact in classes he teaches?"

You mean like Rush or Hannity or ORielly, or everybody at Fox News. The right has made being "Out of touch with reality" an art form.
Thank you for your service which, if you didn't notice, was meant to defend his right to voice his opinion

you have a right to voice your opinion just remember who gave you that right

If Mr. Avery is opposed to standing behind our troops, he should feel free to stand in front of them.

Well I am an Iraqi vet and while this man does have the right to express his opinion, I ahve the right to express mine. I truly believe that this souless person does not have the testicular fortitude to go serve in a war zone and fight. In case you are wondering what I did in the Army I was a medic who would die and kill to protect his men would he? you do not serve and die for the Flag and apple pie, you serve fight and die and kill for the people next to yuo are just as scared as you are. Shameful, well maybe but to me what is shameful is the fact that there are people in the world that kill their own people and create terrorists so tha we ahve to fight to make the world and our country a safer place for all, even this man so he is safe enough to express his thoughts with out fear of horrible consequences like the same type person would in another country. Yes America is the greatest country on Earth, ever wonder why, well as a Vet, I am sure he has the answer.

Everytime I hear crap like this it reminds me of being in the service during Vietnam. Chickens**t morons that have never spent one second in uniform, dumping on the Military. Put on some fatigues and walk in my shoes. I have a 7.62 enima for you yellow belly.

Another reason to dislike lawyers, how screwed up can that perspective be. Send him to the Afgan desert and enjoy the freedom the Talibannies will give him!

I do agree that the man is an idiot, but, unfortunately, one of many. I do ask that you not bash all lawyers. The are many fine officers in the military services JAG Corps, as well as many fine civilian lawyers. Many active and Reserve lawyers have served combat tours.

This guy is a poster child for what is wrong with American Education. Feel good courses, no competiton because, god forbid, the ones who can't perform may be left behind to do something else other than be part of the "entitled" unemployed lawyers. In the old days these folks were the plumbers, electricians, mechanics and yes, even the garage inventors that built companies like Apple and Microsoft. One day this system will eat itself. India, Japan, Korea, China graduate per captia more engineers and scientists than we do by a wide margin. No wonder we have to import them to the jobs we used to graduate people to do. Time for "liberals" to leave the hallowed halls and be replaced with people who want to teach our fututre generation to compete with the rest of the world. We are rapidly being outclassed by these countries where true excellence in both student and teacher is expected and respected. To me a Care package to one of my brothers is a gift of appreciation anf thanks for what they may have once done for me. For we were' soldiers, sailors, airman, or marines, and young once.

Wow!...I think back to my days in college AFTER serving in the Marine Corps infantry and with a security company and I recall many professors whose mindset equals this Avery fellow. Unfortunately for them, I realize that one day they will meet a fellow some of us call God. It is there that they will be "taught" about all the years they got it wrong and how their ungratefullness for the blood, sweat and tears that poured from the American fighting men/women provided their perch from which they vomit their ignorance. And they are forgiven.

My Marine side, well, if I type those thoughts here, someone will track this IP address and question my outburst. So if Professor Avery is not lucky enough to leave this world before Armageddon, I can almost gaurantee he will search for those same men and women to save his backside. I ALMOST feel sorry for him. Semper Fidelis Marines and God bless those who fight to keep us free.

Sent to: mavery@suffolk.edu
Sir,
It is with pride that my fellow members of the US military deliver your right to free speech. I cannot, however, endorse your expression of shame for the members of the military serving in harm's way.

I ask only that you take a moment to review the comments posted at the American Legion website at http://burnpit.legion.org/2011/11/law-professor-shameful-support-men-and.... You will find that you enjoy limited support.

Regards

Bring back the Amish tradition of Shunning. NO ONE is allowed to speak to this scumbag ever again.

Some people are just plain stupid, others have to get an education to become stupid.I would bet if his mommy was still alive she would still be changing his dirty shorts,

Just emailed this idiot to remind him who defends his right of free speech! I'm an S.A.L. member, who's father served in WWII. I'm proud of my father's service, & proud of the service of our troops today, and will support them always! Thank you, troops for your service that keeps us a free country!

By his words you know him. His point of view is his problem pray it never becomes ours.

This is an outstanding example of what oxygen deficiency will do to you.

The professor only brings to mind an old saying. Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. By the way, I wore that red, white and blue AA patch for 16 years. RVN 67-68.

Of course this idiot has a right to say what he thinks. I would invite him to leave this country and go spout that sort of crap in any other country in the world and see what happens to him. We vets have fought and died for idiots like him?? Makes you question why.

Sent to Dean and Professor of Law, Camille Nelson, cnelson@suffolk.edu

Dean Nelson,
Perhaps you aware of the opinion espoused by Professor Michael Avery, particularly his expression of shame at the service of America’s sons and daughters serving in the US military.

While I trust that you fully support the First Amendment guarantee of free speech, I ask that you review the commentary posted by current and former members of the military in response to Professor Avery’s statements. You may reach the American Legion website at http://burnpit.legion.org/2011/11/law-professor-shameful-support-men-and....

Should there be interest from those whose opinions differ from Professor Avery’s, the USO (www.uso.org) provides an easy avenue to make a donation on behalf of deployed service members. I am a proud individual donor to the USO.

Best regards

Sent to Karen Blum, Associate Dean and Professor of Law, kblum@suffolk.edu

Dean Blum,
Perhaps you aware of the opinion espoused by Professor Michael Avery, particularly his expression of shame at the service of America’s sons and daughters serving in the US military.

While I trust that you fully support the First Amendment guarantee of free speech, I ask that you review the commentary posted by current and former members of the military in response to Professor Avery’s statements. You may reach the American Legion website at http://burnpit.legion.org/2011/11/law-professor-shameful-support-men-and....

Should there be interest from those whose opinions differ from Professor Avery’s, the USO (www.uso.org) provides an easy avenue to make a donation on behalf of deployed service members. I am a proud individual donor to the USO.

Best regards,

I do agree that the man is an idiot, but, unfortunately, one of many. I would ask that you do not bash all lawyers, as the military has many fine JAG officers and there are many fine civilian lawyers. Many active and Reserve JAG officers have served combat tours.

Sounds like another idiot liberal that thought himself above military service to this country. If he is old enough to have been around for Vietnam he's probably one of the gutless wonders that ran to Canada or married the 1st woman he could find so he didn't have to worry about the draft.
Dave Morris USAF 1963-1969, VTARNG 1980-2002

War is obscene. The battle field is full of exploded ordinance, marred with all kinds of debris and even body parts. It has an odor of gun powder and explosives and piss, shit and death. I hate war, but pardon me while I hate this idiot.

No, I don't hate him, I pity him and those like him who hide behind false intellect. They don't understand the meaning of freedom. They have always had someone else pay the price for it. The problem is deeper than that.

We who have served are now sitting back and watching our constitution being shredded by others who have never served. The same constitution we swore to protect from all enemies both foreign and domestic. Professor Michael (Asshole) Avery is only a small part of the problem.

where he gets the freedom to speak his mind no matter how stupid his speech! If people weren't willing to do the 'shameful' killing for their country - there is a very good chance that the professor wouldn't have the freedom to speak his mind! So if he doesn't want to thank those who are doing their duty as they see it - then don't support it - why is it necessary to speak out and degrade those who are putting their lives on the line - something he never did!

this is the sort of pratt who calle d mine and myself war criminals when we ( Australians ) where fighting the Khmer rouge in cambodia , Thats now a free and democratic nation , they are no longer killing people because their cousin did not like socialists or some other pitiful reason. Not all wars are straight up and down like that one , the reason we won is because idiots like him did not think we could win , did not care about the millions in cambodia getting slaughtered by socialists , all they cared about was that the shining future was here for the socialists and that was all ok ..

Support your troops folks , they aint the government , they are you , they fight and serve for you , for love of nation for duty and for their friends back home so they dont have to fight

anyone who belittles that needs to have the crap kicked out of them and Sir i nominate you for a first class kicking and though i'm still recovering from my own injuries sustained in the ghan , i'm up to doing the job of a peice of crap traitor like you any day ..

Ignorant piece of crap. You support the troops not the operation. We don't choose our missions but we do out duty. I'd like to have 5 min alone with this coward to give some wall to wall counsouling

I guess it is ok to defend murders, drunk drivers, and rapists but heaven forbid we try to show our appreciation to men and women who risk getting killed just so this ninny does not have to worry about getting his caboose blown up by a terrorist. Anyone with logic like this should not have a law license to begin with. Pathetic does not even begin to describe this idiot.

This professor is like many of them that are wrapped up in their own egotistical minds. It is unfortunate that people like this are allowed to teach young people anything because they are teaching them warped senses of values and alternately doing them a disservice.

I am a Viet Nam Veteran and come from a military family. My family came to this country in the mid 1600's and has served in virtually every war this contry has ever had, and have members of the family serving today on the War on Terror. When I read of someone like Prof. Avery it bothers me tremendously, but one of the rights my family have always fought for was the right to freedom speech. So I have to give him that because that's a right given to him by the Constitution, but one that he has not earned. Here's a man that attended the university of Moscow, U.S.S.R., a man that thinks it's wrong and fights against electronic surveillance of suspected foreign threats, and dedicates much of his time fighting the police instead of the criminals. So is it any wonder that this ungrateful, low life of a human being, would stoop so low as to not support our troops. Here's a man who takes his rights for granted and has no respect for the sacrifices given, so that he may have these rights. Normally I would say if you can't thank a veteran, I would just as soon you say nothing at all. But for this low life, I would just as soon he go back to Russia, he does'nt deserve these rights. I hope that the University he is teaching at is so very proud of this professor they have teaching there.

My Dad, a long-time combat Vet of WWII, used to tell me: "Son, you have to over-look damned fools and little children." The law professor is just such a person. Obviously he has never "been there" or "done that." A care package is such a little thing, but it shows that someone does care. I can remember how important a little package of fudge from my sister became back when no one else was sending "care packages." Obviously, those who know nothing but theory are those with the biggest mouths who constantly prove how little they know. As a career soldier, a lawyer and former law professor, I KNOW the importance of reality vs. theory and in Knowing v.s Thinking. I would love to see how this anal retentive professor, who has probably never humped anything bigger than an AMJUR book, would fare in the middle of the night in some foreign country without so much as toilet paper upon which to rely. It is for just this type of man that we fight so that they can espouse their ignorance from the safety of a classroom.

You should never cross the path of anAMERICAN Soldier, Airman, Marine etc; That has served with honor with your damned attitude. I served 28 yrs in the Army and am proud of every second, to include 37 months in Viet Nam. I have to go with "God Bless Our Troops"

I feel sorry for the students that are having their mind warped by this so called professor.

The one thing this so called professor did was clear up my thinking of college.If this man is the product of a college education, i thank god i never went and grew up street wise.I did get the opportunity to go to korea when i was 22 and was proud to serve my country. Mr lawyer you have no idea how it feels to get something from home when your scared and lonely.This is something you won't learn from your law books.
Its a shame kids are getting killed to protect the likes of you.You should hold hands with your sister in Hollywood( Jane Fonder) she is up for awards even after what she did.Maybe you will get an award too.
asshole of the year.I bet you get fired!!!.If not your college is dummer than you!

to give me the right of free speech. You have no proof that the U.S. military has done anything to protect me in my lifetime. If anything, that have made it an unsafer place for me to live. I didn't ask you to go out and kill people for my sake. In fact, I have begged you not to. Now you want me to support your killing. If you really wanted to support the troops you would support them coming home where they would be safe. Not encouraging them to go kill people. The people they killed were not my enemies. I had nothing against them. The only reason they may want to kill me is because of what our govt, our military and people in this country who have exploited and took advantage of them have done. You can get all hyped up with all your rah-rah militarism and get teary-eyed over the U.S. flag and think it is patriotic. It is not. You bought into all that from the time they forced you to pledge the alligence when you were a kid. If it was WWII again I would gladly go fight against a real threat but since that time the military has done nothing to make me safe or protect my rights. All they did was kill a bunch of people and those that lost their lives did so in vain. I am a true patriot because I think it is shameful and a waste and feel bad that they thought they had to do sol

Phil, Your comment "...You have no proof that the U.S. military has done anything to protect me in my lifetime." begs for a rebuttal. Your use of 'me and my' in close conjunction shows that you live in your own little world insulated from the reality of the bigger picture. People are dying all over the planet from war and have been since and before your measly little butt was born. The fact that you have been allowed to grow to semi-adulthood is not an accident. There are now and have always been a lot of people that would like to come in and take you out simply because that is what they do. That is the reality of the situation you have missed. They haven't because our defense establishment stands in the way. It doesn't matter if the troops are in Afghanistan , VietNam or Iraq. The fact that we have the ability to protect ourselves is our defense. Yes our military goals are not always well defined but that is a political problem that has to be fixed by election of the good leaders that understand the big picture.

To Phil Smith,
My best friend and I joined the Guard to buy a little time with our girlfriends before being sent to 'nam with our unit. Lo and behold, the riots broke out and we were deployed to the streets of America, mostly to protect your lame butt. The threat of riots and the Kent State confrontation pretty much kept us home, ready in case insurgents decided to burn your house or worse. No one I knew or met on active duty or reserve had joined to kill; they joined to serve liberty on our shores and beyond. The professor's assertion that Americans sign-up to kill reveals his ignorance, his arrogance, and his unworthiness. He should feel shame, but I suspect he is uncapable of shame, as are you.

So I guess this wimp was a 4F.... This is about as bad as jim foster asking obozo to speak to a bunch of veterans and it would be a sure bet that not one of those veterans that were at the convention fought to defend socialism. but foster had the anti American racist marxist muslim POS speak anyhow..... so now foster isn't the only one that sucks he is joined by the anti American non veteran teacher....

This guy is definitely a sexual intellectual!

Check out his Bio at the Suffolk website. This knuckelhead went to the University of Moscow 1968-1969. No wonder he hates our troops. He's a Commi!

Check out his Bio at the Suffolk website. This knuckelhead went to the University of Moscow 1968-1969. No wonder he hates our troops. He's a Commi!

At 17 on 1950 when I qualified for my Perpul Heart in Korea, I believed I was fightsing for the American Way and I still believe that. I know it sound corny, but wtf. And part of the way is tolerating AH's like the professor. Its too bad he hasn't figured out yet that war is part of the human condition. If not we would be extinct. I thank every day the worriors that give us a chance to live free.

Michael Avery lacks the sense of the common dog. His alledged educated opinion did nothing but generate total distain for him mand anyone like him. Let's pray that no one like him ever makes it to the Supreme Court. What an ass!

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News from the World of Military and Veterans Issues. Iraq and A-Stan in parenthesis reflects that the author is currently deployed to that theater.