ACLU files suit against Obama, Petraeus on behalf of dead Al Qaeda terrorists

Raise your hand if you think I am exaggerating with that title....ok, you can put them down now.
Civil rights groups have filed a lawsuit challenging the drone strike killings of three U.S. citizens in Yemen.
The Center for Constitutional Rights and the American Civil Liberties Union filed the lawsuit in federal court in Washington on Wednesday on behalf of relatives of the victims. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta, CIA Director David Petraeus and other high officials are named as defendants.
And just who are these poor victims? Let's look at some quick bios:
Anwar al-Aulaqi: "senior talent recruiter and motivator who was involved with planning operations for the Islamist militant group al-Qaeda." Email pals with Major Nidal Hassan before he shot up Ft Hood. Was allegedly the guy behind the Christmas Underwear Bomber fiasco.
Samir Khan: Pakistani American editor and publisher of Inspire magazine, an English-language online magazine reported to be published by al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. Samir here used to live in his mom's basement in North Carolina and has been stirring up trouble for years, and my friends at "My Pet Jawa" have been tracking him the whole time.
Abdulrahman Al-Aulaqi: Son of Anwar, he was killed after the other two in a targetted strike that is claimed to have killed other AQ operatives.
ACLU for their part put up pictures of a young Abdulrahman and had this to say:
In Al-Aulaqi v. Panetta (Al-Awlaki v. Panetta) the groups charge that the U.S. government’s killings of U.S. citizens Anwar Al-Aulaqi, Samir Khan, and 16-year-old Abdulrahman Al-Aulaqi in Yemen last year violated the Constitution’s fundamental guarantee against the deprivation of life without due process of law.
The killings were part of a broader program of “targeted killing” by the United States outside the context of armed conflict and based on vague legal standards, a closed executive process, and evidence never presented to the courts.
Since 2002, and routinely since 2009, the U.S. government has carried out deliberate and premeditated killings of suspected terrorists overseas. In some cases, including that of Anwar Al-Aulaqi, the targets were placed on “kill lists” maintained by the CIA and the Pentagon. According to news accounts, the targeted killing program has expanded to include “signature strikes” in which the government does not know the identity of individuals, but targets them based on “patterns” of behavior that have never been made public. The New York Times recently reported that the government counts all military-age males in a strike zone as combatants unless there is explicit intelligence posthumously proving them innocent.
Now, the last time I wrote about this subject it got 355 comments. As I noted at the time I wrote that post, the whole situation made me uncomfortable, and I wasn't sure what to think.
If anyone is reading an inherent bias on my part in the preceding, I'd love to know what that bias is, because I honestly have no clue how I feel about this whole thing. I feel uncomfortable with secret bodies not authorized by legislation authorizing things like killings. On the other hand, Awlaki needed to be ventilated and good riddance to bad rubbish. But, we should always think worst case scenario with these sorts of things. Can you envision a scenario where a US Citizen is killed abroad with a drone attack, and he didn't have what was coming to him? Probably we all can. So, what safeguard is there? That's where I get somewhat lost.
I still feel that way. I'm not crying into my pillow at night that these horrible folks got vaporized, not even a little. But I still don't know what the legal mechanism for this is. I had rather hoped at the time that there would be some statement made about how these trials took place in a FISA Court, but I still haven't heard that being the case.
You can see the picture above, that was the last article written for the Al Qaeda magazine by Samir. That's apparently not the Samir that the ACLU and his parents want to remember. From the court filing:
28. Plaintiff Sarah Khan is a U.S. citizen who has lived in the United States since 1992 with her husband and children. Her son, Samir, was born in 1985 and became a U.S. citizen in 1998.
29. Samir Khan attended elementary school in Queens, New York, and high school on Long Island, New York. After graduating from high school in 2003, he moved to North Carolina, where he attended a community college and worked part-time. He left for Yemen in October 2009.
30. Anonymous government officials have told reporters that Samir Khan was a propagandist” for AQAP. The government never publicly indicted him for any crime.
"Anonymous"? That's his magazine up there. If an "Anonymous" government official said that the bright ball in the sky is the sun, it doesn't make it not so. Just head over to My Pet Jawa and hunt through their records for "InshallahShaheed" which was Samir's online name.
This part of the lawsuit apparently had the opposite effect as it was intended, at least for me:
Senior government officials, including Defendant Panetta and President Barack Obama, have acknowledged the responsibility of the United States for killing Anwar Al-Aulaqi. On the same day the strike was carried out, DOD published a news article stating that “[a] U.S. airstrike . . . killed . . . Anwar [Al-Aulaqi] early this morning” and that he had been “high on the military-intelligence list of terrorist targets.”
Yeah, well good for them. I feel a little better everytime I read it, because it means there are fewer folks out there trying to hurt my family, including my brothers and sisters that are still deployed to Afghanistan.
So, I still remain concerned about the way the law of this works, but I'm not losing sweat over these guys here. What say you?
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Comments
Pete Hutchinson (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 4:56pm
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ACLU FILES SUIT
I think we have to be very careful who we target in the future, but so far, I say:- "Job well Done!"
Joe11bravo (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 4:57pm
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ACLU
I am sick and tired of this organization. They have to be American haters. They should have their american citizenship revoked and live in another country. Any country but ours.
Oliver (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:04pm
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ACLU
Send the ACLU over there and we can treat them as terrerists
Lee Coly (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:05pm
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ACLU
We should sue the ACLU for a lot of our military deaths because of their stupid taking up with any thing anti America. The ACLU needs to go to the scene to gather their information for their law suit. Issue them nice shirts with a big yellow strips so they would be safe? For a few seconds?
David Winter (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:07pm
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ACLU
I am really disappointed by the actions of the ACLU. I've always felt they played an important role, but this reflects on them so poorly. What are they thinking and why would they take up the cause for such a heinous act? They have truly lost it. The need to drop the suits, apologize to the American people and withdraw from the public scene until they have a better understanding of their purpose.
Leonard Storlie (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:07pm
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ALCU
Are we not the greatess nation there is when the freedom the military has won for all of us and still allow's us to make jackass's of our self if we so choose.
Murdock Ed
July 19, 2012 - 5:08pm
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ACLU Suing America
It's long been a principle in American law, as far as I know, that taking up arms against the United States causes you to automatically forfeit your citizenship. That's even written in your passport. So these terrorists were, in fact, no longer American citizens and so not subject to constitutional protections. Also, the USA has the right - and duty - to fight back against enemies who take up arms against us. Tough luck, terrorists, you got what you so richly earned.
STerry6032 (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:13pm
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Round em all up, herd em all
Round em all up, herd em all into a big field and show them a whole lot of "friendly fire". Toss in all the Phelps clan and the Westboro Baptist church trash. Maybe they'd like to picket while they're dodging bullets.
Christian Soldier (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:14pm
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ACLU antagonist
I am NOT sorry to say that one cannot be sued for defending oneself. Furthermore, it ought to be against our law for ACLU to have the word "American" in their name; rather, it should read 'Anti-US Criminal Liberties Union". No member of ACLU has ever been in the US military (unless, of course, they received a dishonorable discharge).
Someone should feed some pseudo-intel to Al-Queda 'listeners' that ACLU headquarters is really a front for terrorist interrogations ops.
fred friend (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:14pm
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I am also mixed about the law behind this. But let the rats die
No safe haven, any time, any where. If they are eating lamb kabobs in the bazaar, let them worry that a navy seal may give them 3 in the head. Then let the lawyers sort it out. X:)
navy john (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:52pm
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I agree GO NAVY !
I agree GO NAVY !
No Know (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:22pm
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No No!
How can an American be judged and sued for fulfilling their legally-binding oath to protect and defend America against ANY enemy, foreign or DOMESTIC? This is another example of bad lawyers who have no understanding nor knowledge regarding the laws they went to school to learn and defend!
phil (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:23pm
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In plain English F them & the
In plain English F them & the ACLU! die you bastards!!!!! Time to take them all out!
1SG USA (Ret) (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:24pm
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ACLU = Tradiors
This organization has been nothing but a bunch of tradiors to the American People and they should be sued and hopefully put out of bussiness. They do not deserve to have the name American in their so called title.
Ed K. (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:25pm
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ACLU Sues US
First, we should rescind these American terrorists' citizenship, then kill them. Now we have not deprived any US citizen of due process. They ended their right to citizenship when they decided they no longer wanted to live by our culture and enjoy our freedoms.
Beidler (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:26pm
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ACLU Suit Against Obama
Sure, they can sue. Personally, I think relying on drone strikes is somehat cowardly. The US has superb SpecOps teams (re OBL). Taking out a beligerant is one option. Better, is capture and interrogation by other than physical torture. I feel under Bush and Obama, the Exec was looking for cost cutting. If one can eliminate the opposition from Creech AFB with round bottoms manning the Joy-sticks, that means one can cut the DOD budget. What is the primary responsibility of the US Gov't? Defense. Not the Socialization of society!
Bob Wagner (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:28pm
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ACLU
These liberals have lost their way. The United States need protection from all enemies and apparently that now includes a bunch of ultra liberals calling themselves the ACLU. What is wrong with these people? If they don't like this Country then they should go live in the ones that espouse our downfall. The'll have plenty to choose from.
Preston Itwas19... (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:28pm
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ACLU
The sad part of this is the courts of this time may agree with the ACLU!
Anonymous (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:36pm
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I was going to jump in here,
I was going to jump in here, but you know what, let the dumb a$$es in the ACLU file there law suit. Then we will be able to see just what kind of judges we have sitting on the Federal Bench! GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!
Ceasar (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:37pm
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Aclu traitors
I hate Jane Fonda, I hate aclu. They should all be dropped off in syria right in the middle of all the action. Nuff said.
James D. Lyons JR. (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:38pm
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ACLU Lawsuit on Drone Strike
I have NOT been a fan of the ACLU. This type of activity is not protecting our civil liberties but probabily causing sever harm to them. We need to start a postive American Liberties Organization to get the ACLU to focus on what they say they are protecting.
William A. Whis... (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:50pm
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ACLU sues US over dead terrorists
The ACLU should be put out of business(legally of course). I don't know of a single good thing they have done for this country. They were involved with the civil rights movement in the sixties but were not the driving force behind it and the results of that movement would have come about without them. SO I say try them for treason. Also the constitution says the penalty for treason is death and as for as I am concerned US citizens commit acts of terrorism and those who support them are committing treason.
Bob White (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:52pm
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ACLU
It is time to do away with this group. Let our fighting pepole do what is needed to keep this country FREE. From an old Sailor.
CWO (not verified)
July 25, 2012 - 9:19pm
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Well Bob, assuming
Well Bob, assuming coincidence, if your and old sailor and was an ET1 And taught in Allison Hall, Fort Gordon, Ga, we share history an the similar opinion of the subject. Amazing how the world turns...If there's no connection, thanks for your service.
David (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:55pm
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Interesting Due Process Issues
Let me first say, I am proud to be a former infantryman and an attorney. Let me follow that with I have no reason to doubt that the individuals targeted and killed in the drone strikes which form the underlying basis for this lawsuit were terroists and proper targets of our nation's war on terror. However, several of the individuals killed were also american citizens. Setting aside the ACLU's sensational muck raking and longstanding anti-american agenda for the moment, this case in the abstract does raise some interesting issues regarding the due process american citizens are entitled to abroad.
If some ill advised american citizen decides that Yemen is the must see destination for their vacation abroad and is inadvertantly killed in a drone strike, no due process issue is raised as their was not targeting of the citizen and the killing is the inadvertant result of offensive operations in a combat zone. However, if the individual is an american citizen and a traitor, i.e. a terrorist, and he or she is specifically targeted with a drone strike and killed, huge due process issues necessarily follow.
Can the executive branch, i.e. the President, unilaterally issue a kill order for an american citizen as long as the killing is orchestrated abroad? Clearly, if that citizen were accused of treason while within our nation's borders the Constitution would require that they be arrested, tried, convicted, and sentenced to death prior to their killing by the state. Is a citizen's presence within our nation's borders the only distinguishing factor which precludes our President from issuing what is essentially a writ of attainer for the killing of a US citizen? Surely, this cannot be the case.
It seems to me that if american citizens are met on the battlefield raising arms against the United States, they can, and should be, engaged with deadly force. However, if the mission is to specifically target an american citizen for a drone strike abroad based on their status as a terrorist, prior to the issuance of a kill order there should first have to be some prima facie showing by the executive branch that the citizen is indeed a terroist.
We do not live in a nation where the President may unilaterally order the killing of US citizens, our predecessors began rolling back this precedent with the Magna Carta. The fact that the killings occur abroad does not, in my opinion, alter the Constitutional necessity for independent classified judicial review of such targeted killings. Without such judicial review the power of life and death over all US citizens abroad will have been unilaterally consolidated in the Executive Branch. Such a result flies in the face of the system of checks and balances embodied in the US Constitution.
To be clear here, I am not suggesting that our nation can not freely engaged the enemy in a combat zone for fear of hitting a US citizen. If their are terroists in a shack in Yemen, a drone strike sounds like a great idea to me. However, when the mission is specifically aimmed at killing a US citizen I believe due process requires more than a unilateral kill order issued by the President.
Drones are new and promising technologies, they should be used to the fullest extent possible to kill our enemies and to safeguard the lives of our nation's service men an women. We can get there, just bear in mind our legal system is ancient and moves much slower than emerging battlefield situations. If one ignores the ACLU's inflammatory representation of traitors, we can look deeper and take away some insight about the need for legal reform. I am of the opinion that with thoughtful legal reform the effective use of drones can be sustained without fundementally disfiguring the fabric of our Constitution.
Thoughts?
MOTHAX
July 19, 2012 - 6:01pm
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Hey
David, as both an 11B and lawyer as well, that is exactly what I was trying to say. Even if it was a 5 min hearing at the FISA court, I would feel immeasurably better.
Thanks for the comment.
Email me at MOTHAX(at)LEGION.ORG if you ever want to write something.
And thanks for your service.
Vincent (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:32pm
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reply to David
If the person is defiend as a terrorist engaged in activities to kill American citizens, why does it make a difference to you if the terrorist is also an American citizen? You state "If their are terroists in a shack in Yemen, a drone strike sounds like a great idea to me. However, when the mission is specifically aimmed at killing a US citizen I believe due process requires more than a unilateral kill order issued by the President."
I think you need to figure out why you are justified in killing the non-citzen terrorist first, and then you will have you answer for killing the citizen terrorist.
Jim T (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 5:58pm
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F**king disgusting.
F**king disgusting.
Carl R (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:16pm
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A thoughtful comment by David
A thoughtful comment by David.
Michael McGregor (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:19pm
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ACLU defends terrorists:
When an American joins forces with a nation; grou; or whatever, and takes up arms against their own country; they have forfited their citizenship in that country and no loger have any rights or protectio0ns afforded by that country's laws!!! Of course I keep saying that the ACLU is not for the American people, but is the brainchild of the American Communist party for the purpose of using our freedoms and laws to destroy us from within!!! In my book - all members of the ACLU should be hung by their toes for being the biggest traitor's of all times - Americans for Communism!!! I guess they think we would make a better communist country then Russia, China, North Korea, oir Vietnam!
Another Old Sailor (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:25pm
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ACLU
The ACLU is the legal arm of the radical left, and as such they are happy to defend anyone and everyone that hates our country as much as they do. Only in the USA are the ACLU and all those of their ilk free to tear down the very freedoms that allow them to operate as they do. That degree of freedom exists NOWHERE ELSE in the world. The ACLU and all their sympathizers should pack up and and move to Yemen or a similar country where human rights are all but non-existent.
Gerald T. Richards (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:46pm
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ACLU's Suit on behalf of families of Americans killed by drones
As a member of both the American Legion and the ACLU, I deplore the activities of Americans who take positions and/or arms in opposition to the USA. However, I support the legal rights of these families to make the US government prove that those Americans were indeed opposing the USA by force of arms. After all the civil rights of all of us is one of the right that the constitution guarantees to all. That some one accused these victims of treason, it needs to be proven not simply alleged. How many times has our "intelligence operatives" gotten it wrong? Accusation is not enough.
Lloyd- US Army 63-69 (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:36pm
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THE ACLU EXISTS BECAUSE FREEDOM CANNOT DEFEND ITSELF
I am a proud member of the American Legion and a proud member of the ACLU. I wholeheartedly agree with your view. It's about the Constitution and due process. I personally saw the ACLU defend the KKK and their right to freedom of speech and peaceful assembly. I suspect there are few people who are members of both organizations.
Questions to ask.... .Is it alright to kill innocent members of your family if you are the target of a drone attack?
Have we declared war against the countries where we are conducting these drone attacks?
The answer to both questions is NO!
fREDDIE gUINN (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:51pm
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aclu
i AM A DISABLED SERVICE CONNECTED usnAVY AND YOU ARE WASTING YOUR TIME COMMENTING. tHE gOVERNMENT DON'T CARE, THE aMERICAN lEGION DAM SURE DON'T CARE AND aclu AND OTHER LIKE THEM SURE AS HELL DON'T CARE. sO BLOW SMOKE UP SOMEONE ELSE'S BUTT. tHOSE JERKS RULES THIS COUN TRY ALONG WITH naacp. iF WE HAD A WHITE TV STATION IT WOULD LAST A WEEK BUT THE bLACK eNTERTAINMENT NETWORK IS THRIVING. wHY?
Keith S. (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 6:54pm
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I think that being at the
I think that being at the painful end of a drone strike is a fitting end for these SOB's that take up arms against the US, but I have to disagree with a lot of the comments regarding the ACLU. The ACLU provides an important service in the defense of liberty in this country. The government is an extremely powerful organization and could care less in the rights of individual citizens. Fellow citizens themselves don't stand up for rights, just look at the number of people in this thread calling for expulsion, torture, and murder of their fellow citizens for the grave offense of offering a different political opinion. I don't care for all the ACLU does, but I'm sure grateful they do it.
Rod Vandiver (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:00pm
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ACLU
The FBI, CIA should now be free to spy and ease drop on the ACLU. They have now shown they are for the enemy and against America.
Ex Big Serge (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:03pm
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ACLU files suit against Obama, Petraeus (aka ex Big Daddy CENT)
The ACLU Esquires are looking for headlines in US & world papers/Chicken Noodle News (CNN)/BBC!
It would be nice to see these members of a world wide terrorist orginization put on trial costing US Tax payers millions with the ACLU defending them daily on cable TV. However our friends at Lockheed Martin have saved the taxpayers so much by providing the US Government the tools to deal them what Yahwey, Allah, and/or our Father has ment to be.
Mike Hammond (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:08pm
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ACLU
It,s great,complain all you want. This is still a great country. Only problem is no one has the guts to come here and invade it; see just who will stand up to defend our Freedom. I know we have been suckered punched, but, thats it. If the going gets tough, we,as Americans will stand up to anything the world can throw at us. Not some people that think this can,t happen or are Liberal enough to think that the rest of the world is just like we are. Open our doors (leagally) let the oppressed in and we shall see what will happen when the time comes.
walleye (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:09pm
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aclu..wall street
The wall street bankers didnt do anything the govt didnt let them do..who made the banks give loans to people who couldnt pay for them? Who deregulated the derivitive market? What politicians benefited from the economic down turn? The banks have paid back the tarp..gm still owes tax payers 30 billion on obamas union rescue. The aclu was founded by communists that came here running from nazis...what do expect?
Duke (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:16pm
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Sue me
Next they will try and sue individual soldiers for killing terrorist. I did my part on all 9 tours and I will do it again!!!
V/R
True American
shawn hall (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:19pm
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outraged!
I fought in operation enduring freedom for those that perished during 9/11. Where is the justice for all those families. I would like to sue al qaedada on their behalf. How about that ACLU.
Daryl Tisinger (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:48pm
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ACLU
Good idea!!! Lets send all the ACLU lawyers over there to sue on behalf of all the families that lost brothers, sisters, sons, daughters, and loved ones in 9/11. What a coup for the ACLU if they win!!! Think any of them will volunteer or do they only sue Americans in America for acts against terrorist, communists, facists, and athiest??????
mac (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:29pm
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aclu
the aclu is a bunch of bullshit, always has been , always will be.
Monty (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:49pm
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ACLU
ACLU - Americans Causing Loss of Unity These folks mean well but their common sense for American freedom and preservation has gone out the window.
Douglas Salensky (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 7:59pm
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ACLU Story
Why doesn't that surprise me!
Wayne Childers ... (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:04pm
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Known Threats to the US
If you live in the US and enjoy our way of life, then stand up for our Country and be proud. If you are against our way of life, then get out or expect the worst. Other countries don't put up with individuals who threaten death and distruction, so don't expect it here either! We should have long ago abolished the ACLU and any other agency that goes against our government or our people! They have proven they are not true Americans! Let them go to some 3rd world country and try their garbage!
CWO (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:06pm
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I
Isn't this a great country, or what? Where else can the goats sue the sheepdogs for killing the wolves that attack the sheep? Yes, these are metaphors, but truly reflect the unique greatness of our nation. I sleep very well knowing we have great Americans capable of executing these difficult tasks.
Wayne Hall (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:27pm
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ACLU
I have no problem with our country protecting US. We need to make sure that anyone who does harm to our people are made to pay with there lives. The problem I have with the ACLU is they are tieing up our courts with something they have no business getting involved in. Maybe the next drone drop should be on the ACLU office.
Another Old Sailor (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:28pm
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Loyalty?
Dear Mr. Gerald T. Richards: You Sir obviously do not know where your true loyalties lie. Please immediately resign your membership in the American Legion until you do decide because I have no desire to serve alongside one who is sympathetic to causes that seek to destroy the United States of America.
DAVE CLANTON (not verified)
July 19, 2012 - 8:43pm
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KEEP THE DRONES FLYING
see comment above
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